Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

[Guest]

Jan Markel just had another program on this and it has been discussed here before but wanted to get an update on everyone's thoughts on it, if possible?

2Th 2:3 says,
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;" http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible...2&t=KJV#comm/3

Our 26 year old daughter, who we took to bible-based churches all of her life growing up and she preached to her neighbor friends about the rapture, has now become a fan of Brian McLaren! She has become involved in a home church with no denominational support, that we can tell, and they are into things like the labyrinth, little discussion of scripture and very concerned about being too judgmental in their religious views! She married an ex-catholic, who assured me that he had left the faith but they have both attended some masses since and she has softened on her view of its rituals! It seems to be pretty much of an all inclusive type of religion?

Give us your thoughts, please! head:

[Issachar]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Imvho JohnH, much of the church, if of the church at all, has mistaken being judgemental with judging. I differentiate judgemental as an attitude that Christians should not have whereas judging is something the Word not only tells us to do but tells us how to; according to what criteria. Being judgemental is more akin to trying to remove the splinter from another's eye while having a beam in our own; a holier-than-thou attitude. Judging on the other hand is something we should do in order to keep ourselves and subsequently, the church, pure before our Lord. We are instructed on all sorts of things to reject, stay away, come away from, etc.

The so called emergent church (imho, a prideful name since the church emerged about 2000 years ago. Perhaps "emergent" should be replaced with "coming out" ...), in an effort to not be judgemental, has stopped judging also. They will judge though, those that judge.

just my two cents .....

Issachar

[Guest]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

my reply is that:

imho SOME/MOST OF THE Emergent Church is The End-Time Apostate Church.....

there is a remnant in every denomination who are faithful ping:

[gail]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

The Emergent Church is just part of a much larger problem. We see denomination after denomination becoming apostate in their apathy towards the scriptures by approving of same sex relationships, denying the Virgin Birth, the Diety of Christ, the necessity for the Atonement and the very fact that CHRIST IS THE WAY AND THE ONLY WAY!

[Guest]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Imvho JohnH, much of the church, if of the church at all, has mistaken being judgemental with judging. I differentiate judgemental as an attitude that Christians should not have whereas judging is something the Word not only tells us to do but tells us how to; according to what criteria. Being judgemental is more akin to trying to remove the splinter from another's eye while having a beam in our own; a holier-than-thou attitude. Judging on the other hand is something we should do in order to keep ourselves and subsequently, the church, pure before our Lord. We are instructed on all sorts of things to reject, stay away, come away from, etc.

Issachar

Agreed, Issachar!

I read an interview with McLaren (I will try to find it) and basically he stated that "he was not sure if homosexuality is clearly wrong and after 5 years maybe we will know!"

So, quoting scripture to this church may not be enough but that is not our problem if they want their ears tickled!

[gail]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Agreed, Issachar!

I read an interview with McLaren (I will try to find it) and basically he stated that "he was not sure if homosexuality is clearly wrong and after 5 years maybe we will know!"

So, quoting scripture to this church may not be enough but that is not our problem if they want their ears tickled!

What's with the five years? Is it a trial period or something? head:

[VickiV]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

2 Timothy 3
Perilous Times and Perilous Men
1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."

It's difficult these days (IMHO & experience) to find a church organization that does not value recreation, trinkets and creature comfort above the Word.

[VickiV]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

2Th 2:3 says,
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;" http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible...2&t=KJV#comm/3

I just reread the scripture. Do you see this?
FIRST: THE FALLING AWAY
SECOND: THE AC IS REVEALED

I think we have been seeing "a falling away" for some time. More and more are falling away, but this has been happening for some time now. I always believed, maybe it was traditional thought and teaching, that Believers would not know the AC, that they (we) would be raptured prior to his coming into power and being trust into the limelight so that we would recognize him. But, this scripture just spoke right out to me tonight, almost like I had never really read and understood the words before. It says he (will) be revealed. Revealed to whom? US, The Bride!

[MoreThanConquerors]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

I still can't find a definition of "the emergent church" that makes any sense to me

[Guest]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Here is the interview where McLaren "waffles" on homosexuality! He is a major leader in this movement.

"Perhaps we need a five-year moratorium on making pronouncements. In the meantime, we'll practice prayerful Christian dialogue, listening respectfully, disagreeing agreeably. When decisions need to be made, they'll be admittedly provisional. We'll keep our ears attuned to scholars in biblical studies, theology, ethics, psychology, genetics, sociology, and related fields. Then in five years, if we have clarity, we'll speak; if not, we'll set another five years for ongoing reflection. After all, many important issues in church history took centuries to figure out. Maybe this moratorium would help us resist the "winds of doctrine" blowing furiously from the left and right, so we can patiently wait for the wind of the Spirit to set our course."

http://blog.christianitytoday.com/ou...mclaren_o.html

[Issachar]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

One of the key leaders of today's most cutting-edge church movement has opened an Internet discussion on the issue of same-sex marriage with the bold proclamation that he believes "gay, lesbian, bisexual, transsexual and queer" individuals can and should live out their sexuality in – and blessed by – the Christian church.

"I now believe that GLBTQ can live lives in accord with biblical Christianity (as least as much as any of us can!)," writes author and church leader Tony Jones, "and that their monogamy can and should be sanctioned and blessed by church and state."

Jones is an author and former youth pastor who holds a doctorate from Princeton Theological Seminary. He is also the national coordinator of Emergent Village, a loosely-formed friendship of churches that derive their descriptive name from having "emerged" from postmodernism to take the gospel of Jesus Christ into a post-Christian culture.

The "Emergent Church," as these mostly young, community- and mission-driven congregations are collectively known, is criticized by some for being "theologically liberal," praised by others as the best hope for passing the torch of Christianity to future generations.

More

Issachar

[Guest]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

I just reread the scripture. Do you see this?
FIRST: THE FALLING AWAY
SECOND: THE AC IS REVEALED

I think we have been seeing "a falling away" for some time. More and more are falling away, but this has been happening for some time now. I always believed, maybe it was traditional thought and teaching, that Believers would not know the AC, that they (we) would be raptured prior to his coming into power and being trust into the limelight so that we would recognize him. But, this scripture just spoke right out to me tonight, almost like I had never really read and understood the words before. It says he (will) be revealed. Revealed to whom? US, The Bride!

Vicki, as you say the traditional view is that the falling away is coincident with the rapture which occurs with the removal of the Holy Spirit and then the AC is revealed! It seems that the falling away has been occurring
for some time but it is still hard to believe that we will see the AC revealed but I don't know if we can be dogmatic about either position?

[Jay]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Over the last few years, watching the increasing boldness with which the world speaks against Christ, and looking at scriptural examples of Christ's past rejection, I see the falling away as a time when the world openly says: "away with Him" "we will not have this Man be in authority over us" "they mocked Him".

In other words, as said in Psalm 2, the rulers of the world take counsel together and decide to "sever the cord" and "break the bands". They will force a confession that Jesus is not Lord and Christ. The peoples of this world will mock His name openly without fear. You see this already, but the time will come when the whole earth crosses the line and directs all their hatred toward Him and the Church.

That is the great falling away, in my opinion.

[Issachar]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

At this link are several quotes from those inside the so called emergent church movement, followed by scriptures that counter what they say, followed by Christians outside that movement that counter what they (emergent) say.

Issachar, thinking this emergent thing has taken a real hold these days ...

[Guest]

Re: Is The Emergent Church The End-Time Apostate Church

Certainly, these people can live in their sin, and defy God's definition of marriage.
But the last time people did it on this scale, from what I read, God rained down fire and brimstone.....
We know his views on the subject, and I share them.