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  • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

    Yes yes HSB, and if God in fury and anger decides to initiate The Day Of Vengeance Of Our God to complete and fulfill the double ministry of the Messiah, according to Isaiah 61:1-2, then you and I can see why He will pull out the Chruch "until the indignation be overpast." (Isaiah 26:20.)

    Judgment will so terrible at one point, that its collateral damages upon His people would be so vast, that He will spare them from all of it. That is the only bright hope that anybody on planet earth has at this time. Talking about a blessed hope? It is the only one!

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    • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

      CORRECTION HSB

      You said that I posted that article. That is not quite correct. I deliberately gave the link only, and left it to the reader to go and take a look at it
      Last edited by ZionGene; 06-07-2005, 05:45 PM.

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      • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

        ZionGene: the article in Arutz Sheva that you linked to really shows how frantic the folks are getting. I also felt folks should be aware of it (and agree that the best thing was to simply mention it as you did and let people do the linking themselves..as distinct from quoting the whole article). You had more courage than I to make the link. Regardless of what people in the USA think about all of this disengagement talk, there are now many people in Israel praying for God to act in judgment against the USA. So it seems that the country is between a rock and a hard place..the anger of millions of Muslims and the Moongod Allah, or the anger of some Jewish settlers and their God Yahweh, who just happens to be the Creator and sustainer of the Universe. I still find it incredible that we pray to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, then disregard what He says about His plans for the people of the Land.

        ZionGene you refer to the blessed hope of missing the destruction that God might visit on the nation. I am not so sure that we will in fact escape the collateral damage. In fact the churches are full of folks who have no idea at all what is in store, even whole denominations who have swallowed replacement theology and who are adamant that God is NOT on any side of this issue. What right do we have to duck the destiny of grief and suffering that has been the lot of so many Christians down through the years?

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        • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

          After completing my first 2 courses trough Temple Baptist Seminary (Tenn. Temple U.'s) I just had to come back and reaad, this is just so engrossing.

          I was just reding the other day about Mephibosheth. He - like the ones under 20 whom God called "victims" of the decision at Kadesh Barnea - suffereed collateral damage (being made lame from a fall) but was still able to eat at the king'd table, and be treated as one of Dvid's own. Indeed, he did better than several of David's own.

          I think tht's a very apt anaalogy to the situation we are in. We have to faace trials and problems, and may have to face severe ones, because of the actions of our leaders. However, our sins are the ones we are accountable for to God as far as eternity is concerned. (And they are certainly enough to condemn us without Christ.) It may be rather that those who suffer under ungodly rulers simly get that time in which they have to repent shortened, or they lose some sort of chance for blessings and rewards.

          But, God doesn't change. His mercies endure forever. And, the fact there are Mephibostheths out there (hopefully with easier names to say :-) just means that there are some poeple who lose a little something in this life because of the errors of leaders. Saul's sins indirectly led to his nurse fleeing with him and him being mde lame. Other people may lose their very lives (like those judged when David wanted to take aa census.) But, all they lost was something that was going to be gone, anyway - use of part (M.) or all of their earthly bodies.

          I think that's something that causes a lot of people to have problems. They think that life on this Earth is soooo important they lose the focus that what is taken from poeple when they are judged is something they couldn't keep anyway. Hey, I know the feeling, it's been tough for me, too, and required a lot of prayer asking God for wisdom, which He promises to give. (James 1:5)

          So, whatever happens to America, I will keep praying for revival - it could still happen, perhaps there will be problems so severe many will wake up and this time not hit the snooze button. But, whatever happens, the things we lose were not ours to begin with. And if a person is saved they will gain eternity anyway, just as M. eventually got to sit at King David's table and be treated as Dvid's own.
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          • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

            HSB, I am not so much concerned about Christians in this nation alone escaping judgment, as I am for Christians all over the world. What the human race is doing, is provoking God to the kind of terror upon the earth, which only a prophet like Zephaniah spoke to, and which will cause even believers in Christ, to ask like David once did of God, "Has thou forgotten to be gracious."

            Another point to be raised is this. I thank God--as all of us should--that it will not depend on my perfect stance--not even toward Israel, nor prophetic truth--in order to escape the judgment of God. Many presently theologically unsophisticated--and largely ignorant--believers will be in heaven

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            • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

              http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44650

              I really liked this article about N. American Christians living among the Israelis in Gush Katif, protesting the withdrawl. The pictures of everyone wearing their orange t-shirts are interesting after what we heard from HSB's trip, the orange sheep and all.

              "It blows your mind," Rabbi Ari Griever, a Philadelphia resident, told WND. "Gush Katif is nothing like the media tell you. This isn't Jews living in Arab lands. It's one of the most beautiful Jewish communities in the world, totally away from the Arab population. The residents here just want to live in peace."

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              • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                Sandi: something just for you...
                Last edited by HSB; 06-09-2005, 11:36 AM.

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                • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                  Well... Sandi and I were talking about this thread last night, so I popped in to see if there's any hope that I could possibly get a handle on it so late in the game and... what a delightful picture to see. I'm sure Sandi will be blessed by it. I know I am.

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                  • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                    HSB, you're such a romantic! How adorable! I hope those little fellas are getting out and about (oot and aboot ) to drum up more support for the settlements. I know they captured my heart!

                    Thanks HSB!

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                    • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                      Another article on the Gaza pullout.

                      http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050609/D8AK3EH00.html

                      Israeli Court Stops Gaza Pullout Challenge


                      Jun 9, 8:33 AM (ET)

                      By STEVE WEIZMAN

                      JERUSALEM (AP) - Israel's Supreme Court ruled Thursday that Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's Gaza withdrawal plan is constitutional, removing the last legal obstacle to this summer's watershed pullout.

                      Also Thursday, Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas was meeting militant groups in Gaza to try to resolve domestic political disputes and keep a shaky truce with Israel alive. Israel and the Palestinians are trying to keep the cease-fire intact to allow them to coordinate the Gaza pullout, scheduled to begin in mid-August.

                      The 11-judge Supreme Court rejected 12 petitions by opponents of the withdrawal from the Gaza Strip and four West Bank settlements, ruling the pullout does not violate the settlers' human rights.

                      In their 320-page ruling, the judges upheld four technical challenges dealing with financial compensation for settlers to be evicted, but stressed that the withdrawal itself is constitutional. One judge dissented, arguing that a law governing the pullout is unsound and should be repealed.

                      Yoram Sheftel, an attorney for the settlers, said his expectations were low because the Supreme Court has a tendency of backing the government against Jewish settlers.

                      Since Sharon already has won parliamentary approval for the withdrawal, the court decision exhausted the settlers' legal options for halting the withdrawal. The plan would uproot 9,000 settlers from their homes.

                      Justice Minister Tzipi Livni praised the court's decision, and expressed hope the ruling would defuse potentially violent settler resistance to the evacuation.

                      In recent weeks, opponents of the plan have blocked rush-hour traffic on major highways and sabotaged public buildings. Security officials have warned that a small number of hard-liners will likely resist the pullout by force.

                      "I hope this ruling makes it absolutely clear to the individual settler that the plan is going ahead," Livni told Army Radio.

                      The ruling comes as opinion polls show that the public's support for the plan - which was initially around 70 percent - is dropping. Recent polls show support for the plan at around 50 percent.

                      Despite the judgment, Gaza settler leader Avnr Shimoni said he still hoped that public opinion would l derail the plan.

                      "The polls show that the public is opposed," he told Army Radio. "In the end this is what will pressure our parliament to decide against this."

                      Israel and the Palestinians have agreed to coordinate the Gaza pullout to prevent violence or chaos during the operation. But the two sides have made little concrete progress.

                      Late Wednesday, Israeli Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz and Palestinian Interior Minister Nasser Yousef held talks in what was described as a "positive atmosphere." They agreed to step up cooperation ahead of the withdrawal, officials said.

                      But Palestinian Cabinet Minister Mohammed Dahlan, a top official in charge of preparing for the withdrawal, said Israeli coordination efforts have been poor. He accused Israel of failing to turn over key information about the settlements and failing to address Palestinian concerns about movement in and out of Gaza after the pullout.

                      "We are in a race against time. The Israelis are wasting this opportunity," Dahlan told journalists in the West Bank.

                      A new round of violence has increased Israeli fears that the cease-fire could collapse and militants will fire on settlers and security forces during the evacuation.


                      Abbas arrived in Gaza on Wednesday night against a background of violence - an Israeli air strike on a mortar launcher and empty vehicle; and rocket fire at Israeli targets by Hamas and Islamic Jihad. On Tuesday, six people were killed in a series of clashes.

                      Abbas hoped to shore up the truce during his visit. He also was seeking to resolve an election dispute with Hamas. Abbas recently postponed legislative elections, angering the Islamic group.

                      Israel has said it would like to reopen peace talks after the Gaza pullout, but is demanding that Abbas crack down on militants before returning to the negotiating table.

                      In Gaza, an explosion rocked a refugee camp Thursday, witnesses said. There were no reports of injuries. The Israeli army said the blast appeared to have been an accident.

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                      • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                        here's another stinging message, this one from the Golden Report
                        http://www.thegoldenreport.com/asp/j....asp?a=915&z=1

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                        • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                          Hi I'm WendyJ (Canada)and I'm just back from 21/2 weeks in Israel -May28. Sandy my Precept bible Study buddy gave me the web site and since this Wednesday I've been reading all the Ezekiel postings---What a marathon! I have written to 2 acquaintances in Israel (Messianic Jews) --one working with Precept Ministries with Kay Arthur, to see if they are interested in checking this thread out. My friends at Galilee Experience in Tiberias have recommended an expert on the Ezekiel chapters in question. They are inquiring whether he would correspond with us on the list as apparently he is able to see things from the prospective of those in Israel and would answer any questions about those who live in the land accurately. I will let you know more soon.
                          Wendy

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                          • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                            Welcome WendyJ!!! you have already displayed great fortitude in wading through all the Ezekiel 36 posts. Glad to have you with us. I was in israel for almost one month (May) so we were there at the same time. I also was at the Galilee Experience with our group..was last there many years ago. I trust you had a delightful time over there in Israel, and that you got to spend some time in the West Bank settlements. It will be interesting to see what your friends in Israel think of the points made on this thread. Regards and Shalom. HSB

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                            • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                              Welcome WendyJ I am also interested it what your friends might add to this thread.I do not post here often,but the Ezekiel 36 thread for me is the most important thread here,and if I had time to only visit one thread,this would be the one.

                              HSB thanks for this article link,and by the way welcome back in case I forgot to mention!
                              http://www.thegoldenreport.com/asp/j....asp?a=915&z=1

                              kennygg

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                              • Re: Ezekiel 36 and the Mountains of Israel.

                                [ I trust you had a delightful time over there in Israel, and that you got to spend some time in the West Bank settlements. It will be interesting to see what your friends in Israel think of the points made on this thread. Regards and Shalom. HSB [/QUOTE]

                                Actually I was with Kay Arthur's group and I tried to talk to as many people as possible. I did not get to the settlements. I wish I had been reading this thread before I went. I would have gon eon my day off. I was surprized by the trip -its was unexpected. To tell you the truth, I always cheered for Israel because they were God's people but that was as far as it went.

                                BUT when I landed in Israel I was overwhelmed with the spirit of God and such love immediately for the land and the people. One meeting we had was with some young teens who talked with the group and asked why we were there (old Jersusalem) we told them we were Christians and they asked if we hated Israel , we told of our love for it. Then they asked if we hate Jews---what a strange way to converse. We told them we really loved them.

                                Another shop lerk told me that there is a new spirit in the Christians and he sees love from us for the first time in his life. How can this be? These people really need to be loved.

                                The Holocost Museum really socked it to Christians basically blaming most of the persecutions on us. I felt so grieved for the name of Christ knowing His love for them.

                                We also met with Yuri Stern from the Knesset who is in charge of a Christian Jew Allliance Caucus on Judeo Xian values and Promotion. He recommended a book to me by the former tourism minister who didn't like this disengagement stuff and who was killed, The book is just being printed:
                                "God's Covenant with Israel: Established Biblical Boundaries"--if my memory is correct.

                                While in Jerusalem I talked with a few who were infavor of the disengagement plan because of their hopes for peace. They are so tired and can taste peace in anticipation. And this past year they have been teased by the small peace and run after if like a small carrot in front of their noses. I initially thought "great, yes go for it!" But that night as I lay on my bed I thought about Chamberland in England and Hittler and the policy of Appeasement, then I thought about where I was and Whose people and Whose place it was and Who is the Strong Tower where the righteous run to be safe. I became very aware of how wrong that thinking was. And since that night God has placed it on my heart to struggle in prayer for His people, and His land and to give insight understanding and courage to stand in righteousness like Joshua of old to those involed incl leaders in Israel Europe and USA. I do wonder where Canada stands in all this? Anyone have a clue how prominant a position we in the North have taken on this?

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