A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

[wendyj]

Nancy sent me Helen and Sandi this because we attend Calvary Chapels.
I think this is sobering and applicable to the CHURCH in general what do you think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4qKL...st&app=desktop

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

If this did need to be said, I believe it could have been said better.......

[Issachar]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I too attend a Calvary Chapel .. fortunately, our local church is solid in the Word. But we are also aware of some changes in other places. I like Jacob Prasch's message here. It is applicable to the church at large as a call to pay attention to what is sound doctrine.

Issachar

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

Very good message. I actually listened to a prophecy website that talked about just this thing the other day.

[wendyj]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I like what Jacob had to say too. It is what he church needs to heart. I too attend a CC and we are very firm on the Word, church discipline and expository teaching. I hope CC can stand firm in the faith as Jude says. Lewis--Jacob is a man who loves the Lord but his ministry is one of holding people to the Word of God even rebuking when necessary and it is necessary. His delivery is interesting with his poking at his eyes, and spitting when he speaks--ha ha--but we love him and his odd ways---he is brilliant expositor too.

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I like what Jacob had to say too. It is what he church needs to heart. I too attend a CC and we are very firm on the Word, church discipline and expository teaching. I hope CC can stand firm in the faith as Jude says. Lewis--Jacob is a man who loves the Lord but his ministry is one of holding people to the Word of God even rebuking when necessary and it is necessary. His delivery is interesting with his poking at his eyes, and spitting when he speaks--ha ha--but we love him and his odd ways---he is brilliant expositor too.

Agree good film. Agree with what he says. I have been listening on and off to Jacob on Rapture Ready radio. He does have his own style for sure but he gives a great message. He can come across sarcastic but even so what he says is pretty good. I don't agree with everything but most of it.

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I like what Jacob had to say too. It is what he church needs to heart. I too attend a CC and we are very firm on the Word, church discipline and expository teaching. I hope CC can stand firm in the faith as Jude says. Lewis--Jacob is a man who loves the Lord but his ministry is one of holding people to the Word of God even rebuking when necessary and it is necessary. His delivery is interesting with his poking at his eyes, and spitting when he speaks--ha ha--but we love him and his odd ways---he is brilliant expositor too.

Agree good film. Agree with what he says. I have been listening on and off to Jacob on Rapture Ready radio. He does have his own style for sure but he gives a great message. He can come across sarcastic but even so what he says is pretty good. I don't agree with everything but most of it.

[Issachar]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

FWIW .. I sent the link to my Calvary Chapel pastor asking if he had seen this ..

His reply:

Yes. He is spot on in my view. My hope for the Calvary Chapel Movement is they respond biblically. I would think some correction must happen or another split. As for us, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever!

Amen.

Issachar

[wendyj]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

Issachar--Our CC pastor says the same. We need to continue in prayer for this movement to stand firm till the end.

[Glorify Him]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I watched about 10 minutes of it and was immediately offended by his excuse that he wouldn't confront Chuck while he was still alive. This disturbs me greatly and I believe it is part of the problem in the church. What he had to say is not new imho. It has been said before by various people and imho it has some merit. I also noticed that he had all of his "books" prominently displayed so that you couldn't view the video without knowing about them. I found that disturbing. I am seriously disgusted with everyone who is a part of the Body of Christ and feels that they are somehow annointed to be judge and jury about other people. I am beginning to truly believe that when Ghandi said that he "liked your Jesus but he wasn't fond of your Christians" he was spot on. There is so little love shown in the church today. You can be spot on doctrinaly but if you lack love, the love of God, then imho you have truly missed the point of it all. I think this is why so many people think Christians are a bunch of hypocrites who want to judge others and don't walk the walk that they talk.

[wendyj]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

If you had listened, you would have know that Chuck has been sick and ailing both in mind and spirit and the worry now is since there is not a leader at the helm , it is a time of vulnerability for CC. Jacob is concerned about the church and he is spot on --what he has to say is
exhortation. He is calling for people to pray and be careful through this vulnerable time, to watch out for the creep of the emergent church which creeps so slowly, Sandi Helen and I have seen it totally wipe out our former church so much that it didnt even want Bible Study done there unless people paid the church, unless it was RW material. The church has been taken out at the knees going from two services that were full to one service that is 1/3 full --the church may fold--why because they didnt heed the warnings--this was a Christian church. "We are living in times when everyone does what is right in his own eyes"--and that includes the church---people do not know the Word and are not lights in the world but are in bed with the world.

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

it is hard sometimes but we must come to the grips that we are in the last moments. With that Satan wrachets up the pressure on the ones not solid on doctrine because if you get them there it effects every last aspect of the church. I think as a result we see more exhortation going on more than ever. This too is part of love. If you care for someone in the love of Christ admonition is part of the package. That being said one needs to be care how it is done but it should be done. It is only going to get worse as the rapture gets closer. My advice is for myself to be sure I examine me before I examine others.

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

I like what Jacob had to say. I didn't find it mean spirited or judgmental.
No hiding what he sees. No pretending. Just putting it out there for others to take a closer look.

[Guest]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

"Immediately offended," "disturbs me greatly," "part of the problem in the church," "seriously disgusted," "I think this is why so many people think Christians are a bunch of hypocrites," "found that disturbing,...."

GH, I have quoted from your post, a number of strongly stated phrases. With all due respect, I am not drawing this to your attention to attack your post or you personally, but only to point out that probably no one here minds if you don't happen to agree with Jacob Prasch on this matter. What would be nice is if we did not all come away feeling like we are loathed by you for holding a different opinion which happens to align with Jacob Prasch. Love is not always a heart shaped candy; it can be iron sharpening iron, and that is how I see Jacob's message to Calvary Chapels. Let all our communications be seasoned with love.

Eph 4:3 Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace.

[Issachar]

Re: A WORD FROM JACOB PRASCH

Dear GH .. I'd like to address a few of your points.

I watched about 10 minutes of it and was immediately offended by his excuse that he wouldn't confront Chuck while he was still alive.

There is this family; a good family; a large family. All the children, their spouses, the grandchildren, the grandchildren as cousins; maybe some great grandchildren, all regularly get together and have a great time. There is no bickering; there is a lot of caring ... a good family. The patriarch of the family is 94 .. his eye sight is failing, his hearing is very failing, his wife is vey sick, his mind is getting a bit muddled .. can still process mostly, but it takes a very long time. Much care and attention is poured out on the patriarch and the matriarch. Then one day, there is this rift in the family. Say .. a daughter and a daughter-in-law .. as usual (but maybe not always), it is over something insignificant .. but the rift builds. Others can sense this. One starts to pull away from the family .. excuses ... The elderly, soon-to-pass patriarch is mostly .. maybe totally .. clueless about this. Is there a point in filling him in on all the gory details? I say no. Let him pass on believing all is well .. because for now, it still is for the most part .. unless someone confronts someone and deals with the rift. The patriarch passes; there's the funeral, a time of grieving .. now it's time to deal with the rift. Just my opinion. Had the patriarch been the cause of the rift, then that would be another matter .. but he wasn't.

This disturbs me greatly and I believe it is part of the problem in the church.

Just as Mr. Prasch was pointing out something that he believes is a problem in the church; in this case, a particular part of the body called Calvary Chapel.

It has been said before by various people and imho it has some merit.

There is no new thing under the sun. A large part of the reason for that is that the sin nature is the same from generation to generation to generation. God said much to people and nations through out scripture, and a lot of it was stuff He had said before .. but different generations hear things in different ways.

I also noticed that he had all of his "books" prominently displayed so that you couldn't view the video without knowing about them.

That comment reads (I can be mistaken on this) like you're thinking it is Jacob Prasch's books prominently displayed? Using the youtube setting of 1080P on a high resolution monitor, the only books I can tell in the video, are Chuck Smith books. If he was "promoting" any books, they were Chuck Smith's books. My opinion .. is that he is hoping that members of Calvary Chapel might dig up those books and reread them or read them. They are quite good.

I am seriously disgusted with everyone who is a part of the Body of Christ and feels that they are somehow annointed to be judge and jury about other people.

As members of the body of Christ, we are to judge. The devil has run roughshod over much of the church by promoting the lie .. "Judge not lest .." While the Word of God is NEVER a lie and thereby can NEVER contradict itself, parts of it taken out of context can make a lie. Being based on a bit of scripture, it (out of context) can appear to be truth and therein lies the deception that the devil has been practicing for six thousand years. (see post #15 here) If someone naming themself a believer, comes into a local body, and is somehow convincingly stating that there is no hell, for example .. or that homosexuality is not sin and in fact, (so called) "gay marriage" is ok in the eyes of God, or any other heresy, it is up to those that stand of God's Word to correct that person and if they don't receive correction, boot 'em out. It is for their own good and for the good of that particular local body. If that/those person/people go public .. e.g. talk shows, book publishing, etc. .. then the rebuttal and a call to stick to the Word of God should be public. If one thinks about it, any correction in the body must mean there was a judgement that something needed correcting. No correction = train wreck. We've all seen/are aware of .. many.

I am beginning to truly believe that when Ghandi said that he "liked your Jesus but he wasn't fond of your Christians" he was spot on.

Don't go too far with that. Ghandi was a pagan and opposed Jesus.

Matthew 12:
30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathers not with me scatters abroad.

Ghandi may have been a very nice guy with some very unique characteristics, but I also know some wiccans, homosexuals and drunks that are "nice people." Of course, Ghandi was none of those .. but my point is, being "nice" isn't what it takes to be a follower of Jesus. I know you weren't saying "being nice" means that. But my point is that Ghandi's views should be ignored because they are "of the world." Part of the beauty of the Word of God, is that God chose not to hide anything. Right there, for all to see, He includes in His Word some very nasty characters/actions that are still used by Him .. as long as they repent and turn from their wicked ways. Most, if not all, "religious" books (of the world) only say great and mighty things about the main characters. God is honest.

There is so little love shown in the church today.

Agreed. There is much sin tolerated; much false teaching tolerated .. all to the detriment of the members. God is a God whose name is Jealous.

Exodus 34:
14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
15 Lest thou make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and they go a whoring after their gods, and do sacrifice unto their gods, and one call thee, and thou eat of his sacrifice; ...

Of course this "Jealous" is not of the envious sort such as our sinful human nature might experience. This is a "Jealous" that is for the love of His people. He doesn't want them going after something that will hurt themselves; bring their own destruction. How much love does a mother have for her toddler that is going as fast as he can into a busy street, and she simply says, "Oh, he'll probably be ok." and doesn't make a move to stop him. None. In fact, she'd be insane. But her love will cause her to judge that this is a dangerous, terrible situation and she will run, even with no thought about herself, to save the child.

You can be spot on doctrinaly but if you lack love, the love of God, then imho you have truly missed the point of it all.

It is possible to be "spot on doctrinally" and not have the love of God. That is the heart of His doctrine.

Matthew 22:
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Calling on believers to adhere to doctrine as set forth in God's Word is not unloving .. it is loving. When it's not done in love, then the one doing the calling out is too, walking in false doctrine.

I think this is why so many people think Christians are a bunch of hypocrites who want to judge others and don't walk the walk that they talk.

People who are not Christians, don't have the faculty to judge what is a hypocrite. What "walk" are they walking if they can only see what is wrong with who they believe are Christians? I say they are walking a walk that is looking for excuses to not submit to a Being that is higher than they. If they don't believe there is a God, then the worst they can say is that we (Chrsitians) are just a silly people. But to say we are hypocritical, means they are comparing us to some standard. From what standard do they draw their opinion? Why don't they look at the Christian that is out in -15 degree weather with a windchill of -45, offering shelter and food to the homeless, and say, "Now that is what I want to be."?? There is more good done by millions of Christians than anyone else. Hospitals, free clinics, ... the list is long. Is there hypocrisy among Christians? Absolutely. There is among unbelievers too. Why don't the nay sayers look at unbelievers hypocrisy and say, "I don't want to be an unbeliever because they are hypocrits."?? They have to choose. It's them and God in the end.

I enjoy watching glass blowing. Ever been to Sauder's Village? They take this long rod with glass on the end of it, out of this very hot furnace, and what do they have? A blob. Nothing very pretty. They constantly rotate it, they muush it, dent it, reheat it, do all sorts of things to it ... and in the END, it is something quite beautiful .. and it started out as common sand.

Issachar