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**Andy** · 09-08-2005, 06:12 PM

Second Chances? Part 2

One might ask, are you really trying to tell me that the multitudes in heaven that are talked about in Rev. 7, which we know are ‘Tribulation Saints,’ are people that never heard the gospel before the Rapture?” Yes, this is what I believe. I ask my readers to think about how many tens of millions of people in Communist nations such as China, as well as Muslim led nations all around the world (the list of nations that reject the true God is almost endless) that have never heard of the name of Jesus at all, much less have the opportunity to accept/reject the gospel OF Jesus Christ. Only God knows the number. I also believe there will be some in the US that will have that opportunity. I know that most everyone here in this so-called Christian country has heard of Jesus but how many haven’t heard the real story? So many people view him as a baby born in a manger, not a risen Christ that died for their sins. What about children born during the Tribulation? I believe there will be millions of children, ages 5, 6 or 7 that will accept the Gospel of the Kingdom. Why not? I was saved at age 5.

Many times I hear Matthew 24:14 quoted and put into the wrong context. The verse states:

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come (bold text added for emphasis).

If you look at Matthew 24 as AFTER the Rapture this really changes the view of the chapter. Notice the bold text. It’s the Gospel of the KINGDOM that will be preached, not the Gospel of Jesus Christ that we preach now. So, with that in mind, we see that every man woman and child will hear that gospel, after the Rapture…

Revelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
(Thus fulfilling the Matthew 24:14 necessity to have the gospel preached to “all the world”).

I believe those that heard and rejected the “first gospel” will not be allowed by God (it is the Spirit that quickens the heart to salvation) to accept the Gospel of the Kingdom.

Let me see if I can put things together. The gospel that John the Baptist preached was what? “Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” He knew that the Messiah was here and that IF the Jews had accepted Jesus for who he really was, he would have set up his Kingdom. John 13:1 says, “…when Jesus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father.…” This verse follows right after the chapter where the Pharisees (the religious leaders of the day) had publicly rejected him. Now that it was clear that the leading religious sect had no intention of accepting Christ as their Messiah, it was “time to go to the Father.” But Jesus loved his own SO much that he stayed for the expressed purpose of dying so he could be raised and begin setting up his Church. So, he dies, is resurrected and ascends into heaven, and the Church age begins. Now, approximately 2000 years later he Raptures his Church to himself and things go back much the same way they were before. Sacrifices will be offered in a Jewish temple and that Gospel of the Kingdom will again be preached. The Church age is, in a sense, a huge parenthesis in the plan of God for his people, Israel. Many of the promises in the Old Testament were “put on hold” while the Church age grew. Now, of course, the Church itself was prophesied in the Old Testament as well, but many of the promises specific TO Israel are yet to be fulfilled.

Let’s look at it from another point of view…the viewpoint I’ve heard so many times that says, “God’s grace and mercy will continue to let folks in, even after the rapture”. Noah spent 120 years preaching to those around him but his message was soundly rejected (1 Peter 3:20). Once the 120 years ended and the door of the ark was SHUT there was no more mercy. I’m supposing when the rain started pouring down and the flooding began there were thousands of people pounding on the door of the ark wanting in. Suddenly their faith (or lack thereof) was replaced by sight when the judgement began. It was simply too late to change their minds. Another example: When Lot was taken out of the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah no one believed him. Once the judgment fell there was no way to escape the city. It was simply too late. One last example: when Joshua and the Israelites marched around the walls of Jericho for seven days, any one of those city dwellers could have gone out of the city and begged mercy of the God of Israel and they would have gotten it. They could have even gone to Rahab’s house and sought shelter there and gotten it. BUT … once the walls fell down there was NO mercy shown. My guess is many people ran out of their houses, fell on their faces before the soldiers and begged mercy, knowing that they had been wrong. What would have happened? They would have been killed on the spot. It was simply too late.

I certainly welcome any comments, questions or differing opinions, provided they are based on scripture.

Thank you!

In His GLORIOUS Name,
Andy

**Humble** · 09-08-2005, 06:57 PM

Re: Second Chances? Part 2

At face value, I'd say it has merit.

**Tennken** · 09-08-2005, 10:38 PM

Re: Second Chances?

I have often wondered if the ones that heard the word would have a
second chance after the rapture. I have heard preachers speak on both
sides of the issue. I am glad we will not have to find out.

**wendyj** · 09-09-2005, 12:30 AM

Re: Second Chances?

Andy : When I was reading 2 Thes 2 I too came to the same conclusion. I wondered about your article and what scripture spoke to you on this and not coincidentally it was the same.

It makes sense that those who heard adn rejected would, after the rapture repent and be saved but again God send s that strong delusion and faith is not faith if it is based on sight. Blessed are those who have not seen and believed.

I hope we are wrong Andy, sometimes it seems that scripture is obtuse , this is one of those topics , but I did strongly come away with the same conclusion as you did.

**SoulHarvest** · 09-09-2005, 08:03 AM

Re: Second Chances?

For the most part when it comes to the Bible and reading or listening to others viewpoints I am pretty opened minded. Never being smart enough to know it all but just being smart enough to know that the person that says they know it all, most times knows nothing. I have always trusted in God to lead me knowing sometimes he uses things that you would never think of to open your eyes. Not being the brightest bulb in the batch let me see if I can learn something.

I have a hard time getting my small mind around the, “not having a second chance”, statement. (Not being rude here) It does not make logical sense to me. I have never been to smart but always seem to have enough common sense to keep my head above water. Applying that common sense to this issue seems to have only one answer, IMHO. With my poor spelling and grammar let me see if I can make what I write sensible.

If we look at both Noah and when God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah we see that they are somewhat similar. After Noah had completed the building of the Ark and the 120 years were up God close and sealed the doors. Right after that God destroyed the Earth with the flood. The same can be said with Sodom and Gomorrah. Once God removed his chosen he immediately destroyed them. As with both occurrences there were no 7 year trail to try and wake the others left behind up. As we can see there is a difference between what is to come and what happened during the flood and Sodom.

Now and I am thinking out load here. There are other things that do not make sense to me if there where not a second chance to be saved after the rapture. First the 7-year trail, who is God trialing? I guess you could say it is the Jews that would be left behind. Most likely this is the case as I think about it. The 144,000 also could be there only to lead the Jewish people to the truth as well as the two that is sent from God to witnesses. My mom back in the 50’s always wondered about the two witnesses. She always wondered how they would be seen for 3 days laying in the street around the world. As time went on and technology changed she got that question answered. I tend to want to believe that God would allow the eyes of anyone to be opened along with the Jews if their heart is willing. I also tend to believe in freewill.

The other questions I have while thinking about this out loud are of the mark of the beast. Rev 14:9 comes to mind, it states this; “And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, “ It continues to state that these that chose the mark will be tormented with fire and brimstone. Notice the word “any” within the verse. The verse leads me to believe that there is a choice. I do not see a distinction here that would separate one man or women from the other. To me it simply states that anyone that takes the mark will parish. Taking that statement, as is means we could also read it as, anyone not taking the mark would not be tormented by fire and brimstone. These statements are all inclusive unless we want to assume. Assuming is something I try not to do with God’s word. So I cannot assume that the 144,000 are only for the Jewish people along with the two witnesses. The Bible does not come out and state that only the Jewish remnant that is left on Earth after the rapture will have the chance to be saved.

So to me, to be able to come to the conclusion that there is no second chance after the rapture is just too difficult. I can see both sides but logic, at least to me, would leave me to believe that with freewill anyone would have a chance to find God if they truly looked. We have to keep in mind that there will be some of us that will be left behind as well. I’m not saying anyone on this board but there will be some that preach today that know the Bible in and out that will be left behind. I will take myself for an example. I have studied different theories on the great delusion and have what I believe it will be in my own mind. If I were left behind it would be difficult for myself to be fooled by anything other than Jesus coming out of the sky on horseback. Now that is not assuming that God will blind me so I cannot see even if I wanted to. If we assume that then yes we can believe that there is not second chance.

When I was a kid and this may sound silly now. I wanted God to leave me behind so I could help others to see what the truth was and reveal the lies. As I have gotten older I am not sure I would want to live through that but my heart still wants to be there to spread the truth.

After writing all of this it comes down to one simple reality. Everyone now has the time to get right with God before it is to late. No one should take the chance one way or the other. I do pray that there is a second reprieve for the ones left behind.

God Bless!

**Andy** · 09-09-2005, 08:21 AM

SoulHarvest

For someone that doesn't consider themselves to be very smart that was very well put together! You put together some good points there. Yes, I believe the 7-year tribulation period is indeed Daniel's 70th week and just like the other 69 weeks are "for thy people and for thy Holy City" (Daniel was obviously a Jew and the Holy City is Jerusalem) so will the last week ("sevens") be.

As I tried to say in the article, I really try to NOT be dogmatic about it. I certainly can be wrong (and, as I said, I find myself actually HOPING that I might be!). The article is just the result of a personal study I did on the subject.

**VickiV** · 09-09-2005, 08:36 AM

Second Chances

Originally posted by Andy

As I tried to say in the article, I really try to NOT be dogmatic about it. I certainly can be wrong (and, as I said, I find myself actually HOPING that I might be!). The article is just the result of a personal study I did on the subject.

I agree.....it is the same conclusion that my own study has revealed over the years.....and yet,... I cringe inside knowing there will be loved ones, friends and millions of souls unknown to me who have previously heard and rejected and thus had their hearts hardened....and subsequently will not be able to ACCEPT.....

That's why we need to urge those we know and love to ACCEPT now. I think one of the delusions of this age has been the "second change" theory.... Those not willing to commit use this as an excuse and say when the rapture happens, they will commit. (Still...even though I believe scripture says the opposite......I HOPE they will have that second chance.)

**wendyj** · 09-09-2005, 11:21 AM

Re: Second Chances?

There will be chances for those who have not had the chance to hear who are Gentile and there will be chances of course for the Jews. Probably it is a general principle that no second chances for those who rejected the gospel when they were given chances time after time---IN 2 Thes ch2 He will send them strong delusions---this will happen because they have continued to reject Christ. If they have rejected Christ and His msg throughout their lives, after the rapture---what would they be embracing if they accepted salvation---would they be embracing the cross or saving their skins because of fear or some other motive.

I think 2 Thes 2 is saying no second chances, but God looks on the heart and I bet he would make exceptions for this perhaps, general principle.

When I studied 2Thes2 I thought it was telling me about the concept of no second chances. I've never really discussed this with anyone. It is nice to know that my interpretation is supported by others in this unpleasant topic.

One can get into of course, predestination and free will discussions of the Armenians and Calvinists. But God knows our hearts so. We need to not be slack in giving the gospel inseason and out side of season, more importantly is to live a Godly life---to stand out and stand tall. And for those of us who
have non christian husbands remember they are sanctified by the believing wife. I believe this is saying they are set apart and God's Holy Spirit will continue to work with them and that God's Holy influence will surroound the family so the children will have opportunity to follow the LORD.

This may be a good discussion in itself.

**Guest** · 09-09-2005, 11:28 AM

Re: Second Chances?

I don't believe for a second that anyone who is left behind and realizes their situation, believes and repents will be told "sorry, too late". God is the same yesterday, today and forever, and He has always been One to give second chances. Those who die for their faith will not be the Bride, but those who sit under the altar and are the Great Multitude of Revelation. While the great delusion is sent by God to do it's work, it doesn't ever say that everyone will be deceived by it, otherwise who would be in the great multitude? Also, while there may be many who are deceived, they will be deceived willingly. Those who knowingly and willingly reject Christ today will do so after the rapture. Those who are unsure and/or lazy will either be deceived or they will remember what they heard and believe but they will be tested for their faith in a time like no other and they will be killed for it. God is not willing that any should perish - He is the same yesterday, today and forever.

Think about how Jesus separated those who had hearts to believe and those who did not - he spoke in parables so that those who had ears to hear would hear. In sending the delusion, God is truly dividing those who want to believe, or have ears to hear, from those who desire to be deceived and die in their sins. This delusion is sent to prove the inmost thoughts and desires of every heart, not just against Him, but also for Him.

I would also like to ask any of you, how do you decide what "hearing" the gospel really means? How much does a person have to hear to be considered one who rejects the Gospel? HOw do you think God would judge that in light of His grace mercy and love, and His unwillingness that any should perish?

You also can't use the excuse that since the Holy Spirit will be taken out of the way that there won't be any prompting of the hearts, because there will be a multitude that no one can number who are saved out of the great tribulation. There are many reasons for the Day of the Lord, the Great Tribulation, the Time of Jacob's Trouble. I believe that one of the reasons is to finish dealing with Israel according to God's covenant with them, the other is to put down the god of this world and those who follow him, the third is to set up the Kingdom of God and Christ on earth. Every individual who is able to understand, comprehend and choose to believe in Jesus will be saved but not without great consequence and loss of earthly life.

Another point, as I am thinking here is that the Jews are some of the most vitrolic Christ-haters there are, yet even they will be given the chance to believe before it is all over. Why do you think it would be different for the rest of the unbelieving population left after the rapture?

Just as an afterthought -- In the end, you have three different groups of people left. The Bride of Christ (in new heavenly bodies), the great multitude of every tribe, tongue and nation (dead but clothed with white garments), and the Jewish remnant (obviously alive and still living on earth). But there is also a fourth group mentioned and that is "the Nations", the sheep and the goats. Who are these nations, who makes them up and what will be done with them after they are divided?

**VickiV** · 09-09-2005, 05:04 PM

Re: Second Chances?

Originally posted by Sandylion

I don't believe for a second that anyone who is left behind and realizes their situation, believes and repents will be told "sorry, too late".

I think it will be more of a hardening of the heart.....like Pharoah experienced.

I would also like to ask any of you, how do you decide what "hearing" the gospel really means? How much does a person have to hear to be considered one who rejects the Gospel? HOw do you think God would judge that in light of His grace mercy and love, and His unwillingness that any should perish?

Only the Lord knows the heart. He will be the one that will know, Who knows even now, who will accept and who won't. Who has truly heard and who hasn't.

Another point, as I am thinking here is that the Jews are some of the most vitrolic Christ-haters there are, yet even they will be given the chance to believe before it is all over. Why do you think it would be different for the rest of the unbelieving population left after the rapture?

Those Jews who have heard the Gospel won't get 2nd chances either. Israel as a nation is Saved. Not every single jewish person on earth and not every single jew living in Israel.

**openeyes** · 09-09-2005, 06:12 PM

Re: Second Chances?

I certainly welcome any comments, questions or differing opinions, provided they are based on scripture.

Well Andy,
Interestingly enough, this post is the very reason I joined WEDG some years ago. When I read it back then, it bothered me considerably. I didn't feel bothered for those that this states do not have a 'second chance' as much as I felt bothered for you. I do realize that your main point is that 'they (unbelievers) need Christ now', which is something any Christian can get behind. However, the mindset that your logic portrays in this writing is foreign to me. I certainly do not mean any offense by that, but I am doubtful that you will discuss this with me do to our past discussions (on different subjects) that turned into arguments (which were at the very least 50% my fault).

To believe in such a manner that you present, one must first and foremost believe in a pre-trib rapture, as described by you and the authors you site. Since I don't believe in the pre-trib rapture, your main points (idea behind writing this) are somewhat meaningless to me. And, because I completely respect the rules of not debating that topic on this site, I will remain silent to an in-depth Scripture discussion on the many points that (IMHO) make your idea invalid. However, to avoid any such rule violations or arguments, I can discuss this from a purely fundamental standpoint, (rather than pre, mid, post, etc.).

Perhaps you could think about this part a little more:

If we receive the truth by faith alone, does it make any sense at all that God would make an exception for the after-rapture people? Remember Hebrews 11:6 says, “But without faith it is impossible to please Him (God):” Suddenly they have no reason to accept by faith - instead they actually see that what the Bible says is true. I have heard people say that the greatest prayer meeting ever to assemble will happen immediately after the Rapture by those who have realized that what they had been taught was right after all. Where is faith there?

I am unable to picture a scene in which Christ is not visibly present (more exactly, returned for all to see), that belief in Him (for He is the Word) is not faith. As Christians we have visible proofs that the truth is true all the time. We study prophecy and see it come to pass, we see things in our own lives that repeat to us that He is in control, and we feel Him in our hearts and minds (which are essentially the same thing). We know it's the truth, and that's faith.

Rom 3:22-28
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

We seem to think that faith is only a 'self' thing, and only the substance of things for which we, as individuals, hope. But faith is also the evidence of things not seen. Not seen by whom? The world, which is the very same world that you envision after the rapture. We see the works of Abraham, and to him it is accounted as faith, evidence that God is, to us.

Heb 11:1-7
1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

The elders obtained a good report because their faith was seen. There is a huge difference between what your post says about the time of Noah (Lot also), and the end time. In Noah's (Lot also) time, the destruction (as it were) was immediate. No one (save Noah, Lot, and some family members) walked in the flesh during the destruction. In the end time, the destruction happens when Christ returns. Which, according to your own doctrine, is seven years later than the rapture.
Let's put the linguistic definition of faith forward.

4102 pistis (pis'-tis);
from 3982; persuasion, i.e. credence; moral conviction (of religious truth, or the truthfulness of God or a religious teacher), especially reliance upon Christ for salvation; abstractly, constancy in such profession; by extension, the system of religious (Gospel) truth itself:
KJV-- assurance, belief, believe, faith, fidelity.

4102 pistis-
1) conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the New Testament of a conviction or belief respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervor born of faith and joined with it
a) relating to God:
the conviction that God exists and is the creator and ruler of all things, the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ
b) relating to Christ:
a strong and welcome conviction or belief that Jesus is the Messiah, through whom we obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom of God
c) the religious beliefs of Christians
d) belief with the predominate idea of trust (or confidence) whether in God or in Christ, springing from faith in the same
2) fidelity, faithfulness;
the character of one who can be relied on

3982 peitho (pi'-tho);
a primary verb; to convince (by argument, true or false); by analogy, to pacify or conciliate (by other fair means); reflexively or passively, to assent (to evidence or authority), to rely (by inward certainty):
KJV-- agree, assure, believe, have confidence, be (wax) conflent, make friend, obey, persuade, trust, yield.

3982 peitho-
1) persuade
a) to persuade, that is, to induce one by words to believe
b) to make friends of, to win one's favor, to gain one's good will, or to seek to win one, to strive to please one
c) to tranquilize
d) to persuade unto, that is, to move or induce one to persuasion to do something
2) be persuaded
a) to be persuaded, to suffer oneself to be persuaded; to be induced to believe: to have faith (in a thing)
1) to believe
2) to be persuaded of a thing concerning a person
b) to listen to, to obey, to yield to, to comply with
3) to trust, to have confidence, to be confident

Evidence to whom? ...continued

**openeyes** · 09-09-2005, 06:19 PM

Re: Second Chances?

The next passage of your writing contradicts what you are saying on this matter. I could say that better by saying, "It confuses me.".

I believe very shortly after the Rapture there will be an explanation of the disappearance of those “weak Christians” that put the minds of the remaining world to rest. The 11th verse (of II Thess 2) would seem to agree as God will stop them from believing. Will the explanation be UFO’s? Will it be (as the “New Agers” believe) that these weak-at-heart, non-believers (in the way of “things) have been taking to another planet for “rehabilitation” while those left on earth can finally move to a new level of evolution? I don’t know – scripture doesn’t tell us what it is they’ll believe but one thing I do believe is – I think we’re making a very serious mistake by telling the unsaved they don’t have to accept the gospel now, there’s always later.

It's hard to put what you are saying into perspective.

1. The rapture happens -- some recognize this as prophecy and believe ( you actually say "know") the truth. To me, this is faith as defined by Scripture. It would even fit a scenario of 'the disappearances', should that be what the Scripture says happens.

2. An excuse is given for the disappearances -- this is a lie (according to what you say), but that's not what others believe, they believe the truth.

3. God puts a lie into the hearts of those who recognizes that His prophecy is the answer to these disappearances (which can only be revelation from God in the first place, if that's really what the Scripture says), so that they believe that the lie about the disappearances are true.......whew.....that's actually hard to say.

4. Paraphrase of numbers 2+3: You might be saying that God sole responsibility for the lie concerning the disappearances. Which is to say that because they did not believe in Him by a specific point in time, He will make sure that they don't believe in Him now.... His longsuffering has ended.

It seems to me that one MUST know full well that the rapture happened, AND God lies about it to make them "believe" it didn't, for your post to have any credence whatsoever. According to all Scripture I've read, that makes no sense. What is interesting is that you say II Thess. 2 is the reference for this whole idea. However, the delusion stated there is completely different than an excuse for "what happened to the Christians".

II Th 2:1-3:18
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

It's plain and obvious that Christ will not "appear" until the son of perdition appears first.

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

It says absolutely nothing about the lie being "what happened to people who vanished", but those who had pleasure in unrighteousness believed that the lying son of perdition was indeed Christ performing miracles.

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
16 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace,
17 Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.

The next point you make is equally foreign to me. How many Gospels are taught in the New Testament!? A quick look at verse 14 of II Thess 2 above shows Paul speaking about 'their' gospel. Are we to think that 'their' gospel is different from the Gospel of Christ!? Of course not, but here's what you say:

Many times I hear Matthew 24:14 quoted and put into the wrong context. (so do I

) The verse states:

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come (bold text added for emphasis).

If you look at Matthew 24 as AFTER the Rapture this really changes the view of the chapter. Notice the bold text. It’s the Gospel of the KINGDOM that will be preached, not the Gospel of Jesus Christ that we preach now. So, with that in mind, we see that every man woman and child will hear that gospel, after the Rapture…

Revelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
(Thus fulfilling the Matthew 24:14 necessity to have the gospel preached to “all the world”).

I believe those that heard and rejected the “first gospel” will not be allowed by God (it is the Spirit that quickens the heart to salvation) to accept the Gospel of the Kingdom.

Let me see if I can put things together. The gospel that John the Baptist preached was what? “Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” He knew that the Messiah was here and that IF the Jews had accepted Jesus for who he really was, he would have set up his Kingdom. John 13:1 says, “…when Jesus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father.…” This verse follows right after the chapter where the Pharisees (the religious leaders of the day) had publicly rejected him. Now that it was clear that the leading religious sect had no intention of accepting Christ as their Messiah, it was “time to go to the Father.” But Jesus loved his own SO much that he stayed for the expressed purpose of dying so he could be raised and begin setting up his Church. So, he dies, is resurrected and ascends into heaven, and the Church age begins. Now, approximately 2000 years later he Raptures his Church to himself and things go back much the same way they were before. Sacrifices will be offered in a Jewish temple and that Gospel of the Kingdom will again be preached. The Church age is, in a sense, a huge parenthesis in the plan of God for his people, Israel. Many of the promises in the Old Testament were “put on hold” while the Church age grew. Now, of course, the Church itself was prophesied in the Old Testament as well, but many of the promises specific TO Israel are yet to be fulfilled.

??

If the "everlasting gospel" is not the gospel of Christ, then what is it? If the gospel of the Kingdom is not the gospel of Christ, then what is it? Is the gospel of God different than the gospel of Christ? There is only one gospel. Christ has many names, but there is only one True Christ. YHVH is one essence made of three. Christ is the King, He is eternal. His gospel is eternal. His Kingdom is eternal.

Mark 1:1-15
1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;
2 As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.
4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.
6 And John was clothed with camel's hair, and with a girdle of a skin about his loins; and he did eat locusts and wild honey;
7 And preached, saying, There cometh one mightier than I after me, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to stoop down and unloose.
8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.
9 And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan.
10 And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:
11 And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
12 And immediately the Spirit driveth him into the wilderness.
13 And he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.
14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Let's see, who is it that preached the gospel of the Kingdom of God? Is is different than the gospel of Christ? ...continued

**openeyes** · 09-09-2005, 06:23 PM

Re: Second Chances?

Mark 13:10-11
10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

Which gospel is this? Is the gospel of the Kingdom of God different than what Christ Himself preached?

Luke 4:14-20
14 And Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee: and there went out a fame of him through all the region round about.
15 And he taught in their synagogues, being glorified of all.
16 And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.

Which gospel is this one?

Rom 15:18-21
18 For I will not dare to speak of any of those things which Christ hath not wrought by me, to make the Gentiles obedient, by word and deed,
19 Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
20 Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
21 But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.

When does this gopel end?

Please do not take these posts as arguments, but rather as someone who really cares about the Word of God trying bring edification.

In His Love,
openeyes

**Radio Free Narnia** · 09-09-2005, 07:46 PM

Re: Second Chances?

Andy, I too am a bit confused. By my understanding of your definition of faithin your original post, Noah, Moses Elijah and Samuel did not operate on faith, but on certain knowledge, as God spoke to them directly. Please correct me if I have misinterpreted your statements. No offense intended, I'm just not sure I understood you correctly.

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